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  •  sundance
      sundance
An alternate iceberg damage theory
#1

Joined: 2004/12/28
From Molly Brown's home town
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Here is the best photo of the suspected iceberg that
is believed to have sunk the Titanic. It is the only
surviving photo of that berg. It was made into a post
card.
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v607/sundancekid17/Iceberg/titaniciceberg.jpg

A friend of mine on another discussion group and I had been dicussing the possibly of running aground the iceberg by the Titanic and that the damage
would have been to the very bottom of the Titanic. I am more and more
interested in the possibility that there are several
factors that if this scenario is correct that these
factors can be devastating in the behavior of the
steel plates.
First one needs to go back and read the
testimonies of those survivors who testified that the
iceberg extended above the railing and that when the
titanic side swiped the iceberg that the ship was
close enough to the wall of the ice berg that the ice
debris actually fell on board the Titanic.
Now iceberg configuration is very important to
understand. The typical iceberg floats with a average
of only 10% of the ice above water level and the
remaining 90% is submerged. This is a basic formula
but to be more exact explanation of the "tip of the
iceberg" expression can be explained as follows:
Icebergs float because the density of ice (around 900
kg per cubic meter) is lower than that of seawater
(around 1025 kg per cubic meter). The ratio of these
densities tells us that 7/8 of the iceberg's mass must
be below water. Usually icebergs are 20% to 30% longer
under the water than above and not quite as deep as
they are long at the waterline. If you look at a
surface level view of a iceberg you will see that the
submerged portion will extend in all direction past
the surface ice's walls. See the following iceberg:
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v607/sundancekid17/Iceberg/iceberg.jpg
Now for the Titanic to be close enough to brush the
surface walls and allow ice debries to fall onto the
deck than it is safe to assume that she had to past
over the larger submerged counter weighted larger mass
of ice.
Now if the Titanic did ride up on this submerged
ice than a new factor is introduced! Before we were
figuring the ship's speed of 22 1/2 knots striking at
a slight angle a floating iceberg. If that were the
case that the blunt trama force would be decreased
where as the iceberg would actually be pushed sideways
to a small degree and the Titanic would herself have
experienced a kinetic strike and would have caused the
bow of the ship to slightly bounce way from the wall
just before being forced back toward the stern when
the stern get kicked out away from the iceberg.
Factoring in the weight of the loaded payload area
and all the supplies, crews and passengers plus the
actual ship and now enter the senerio that the Titanic
did ride up on the ice. First thing you now introduce
a new factor that being the weight of the Titanic
bearing down on the irregular submerged ice surface as
it slides over the submerged ice shelf. (Not floats
over but skids across the ice with the weight of the
Titanic exerting a heavy downward force.) This would
definitely have increased the amount of force excerted
to the bottom steel plates. The weight of the Titanic
bearing down on the bottom plates in contact with the
ice would be many times greater that those plates on
the side that side swiped the side of the iceberg.
Here are some more aerial photos of icebergs where you
can see the submerged ice that extends out past the
surface walls.
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v607/sundancekid17/Iceberg/blockiceberg2.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v607/sundancekid17/Iceberg/101Iceberg.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v607/sundancekid17/Iceberg/051Iceberg.jpg

Now to be close enough for the wall of most common icebergs to extend over the railing yet be close enough to fall onto the deck you can assume that the Titanic would have had to rode up on the submurged portion of the iceberg. If you go back and look at the actual Titanic iceberg and view the suspected damage the Titanic had believed to have caused on the iceburg you can see that the side of the Titanic would have actually been up against the above surface portion of the iceberg.
I would be interested in your opinions!

Sundance
Posted on: 2005/1/15 20:46
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Re: A alternate iceberg damage theory
#2

Joined: 2005/1/2
From United Kingdom
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I read of the possibility that the ship went up and over a part of the ice-berg it would explain an aufal lot.
_________________
Where the hell did my 1800 posts GO!!!!????? :P
Posted on: 2005/1/15 21:27
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  •  clinton
      clinton
Re: A alternate iceberg damage theory
#3

Joined: 2005/1/8
From London UK
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I agree that it seems possible for the iceberg to have caused damage under the Titanic in what you have described as a "running aground" type collision. It is simply impossible to be 100% sure without having a look at the keel plating of the ship and that is impossible to do.

I am however sceptic at what appears to be newly released photographs of the "real" iceberg that sank the Titanic. Let us not forget that the iceberg field streched about 70miles of ocean the night Titanic went down. In the days that followed the accident, many other passenger ships had passed Icebergs, which looked like the "real" berg. The truth is we will never know what the real iceberg looked like. 70miles of ocean is quite a big area in which to go scouting around looking for a single iceberg when in fact the ocean was littered with bergs in April 1912. Besides, if I were to be on a ship during the days following the disaster that happened to pass an iceberg, I would also take a photograph of any old iceberg. Urban legend wants us to believe all sort of unproven "facts". Like a photograph of the "real" iceberg which is now locked up in a safe in Munich (or is it Zurich) for some weird reason...

What do you think? As far as history is concerned; the real iceberg disappeared into the black night behind Titanic.
Posted on: 2005/1/18 10:42
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  •  sundance
      sundance
Re: A alternate iceberg damage theory
#4

Joined: 2004/12/28
From Molly Brown's home town
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t's easy to see how people can arrive at different conclusions on this one.

If you read that article at the last link, then it surely makes more sense. These 4 points of fact are then worthy.
1. The photograph was taken shortly after the tragedy in a certain vicinity to the place where the dead bodies and the wreckage of the ship were drifting in the water. This is also true for the other, well known, photographs claiming to show the fateful iceberg, but this is the only link they can claim except the red color of the Prinz-Adalbert iceberg .

2. The shape and details of the Rehorek iceberg match the drawings made by eye-witnesses. And the shape perfectly match the Rock of Gibraltar that had been compared with the iceberg by the eye-witness Joseph Scarrott.

3. The otherwise undamaged iceberg displays only one place where ice has been chipped off.

4. The damage to the Rehorek iceberg is at exactly the spot at which the Titanic would have hit it

It's no secret why the photo was locked up, it must be worth many $! There is no doubt it's date, since it was stamped at the post office."
Posted on: 2005/1/18 18:40
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