yep your right Betty, i really hate the Iceberg, he is the biggest villian IMO lol :wink:

Bruce Ismay had to live with his conscience when he took that seat and I am sure did until the day he died. But what if it had been Mr. Astor, who's wife was pregnant and he took the seat, would everyone have thought he should not have even if he looked around and saw no other women or children near.

Was it really because he was a company man (Ismay) that he got so much attention in surviving?

wow...good point Betty.

I dont think any of us have the right to judge him. Unless you have been through something like that. He was only trying to save himself. No differently than you or I. Sure, we could say because of his position he should have stayed on board. But that would have added on to the death toll. As some of you have said, he had to live with the knowledge that he left 1500 people to die. That was bad enough.

I know that Ismay was the owner of White Star Line but I think he get's treated a little harsh. He was just a passenger on the ship with the captain being the absolute authority. Also, Ismay was helping load the lifeboats before he got in one himself. Even JCs 1997 movie helps put Ismay in a bad light. Thomas Andrews, the designer and builder, nobly dies on the ship but Ismay, the owner, "sneaks" into a lifeboat. What about the other 1st class men who lived? What about the crew members that lived? No body ever laid them with the blame for living while so many other women and children died. What happened then cannot be changed and arguing about it doesn't change it. Did anyone watch Ghosts of the Abyss? Bill Paxton talks about putting himself in the place of a man having to put his wife and kids in a lifeboat. If you have the movie, watch that part. We can all say, "Oh I would have gone down with the ship" but if you were actually put in that position, what would you really do? I have a husband and 2 kids. If I were my husband (I know him well enough to say this), I would be dying inside knowing I would probably never see my family again. I would want to save myself too. It's not that I'd be selfish, it's just that I value my life. What makes one person more important than another? We are lucky to be alive in a time where we don't have to worry about these issues like "women and children first"

Freitas,
IMO, I do believe Ismay was made the scapegoat, because he was a company man and also because he lived.

Sir Cosmo Duff Gordon Got into a lifeboat with lots of room for other passengers and did not give a darn to go back and rescue a few more passengers, and I believe he did not suffer as much as Ismay.

I also do not know what I would have done in the same situation.

[quote:b8d8b38259="Betty"]I just found this little bit of info in a book.

In April 1912 Ismay's presence aboard Titanic was twofold: to observe the liner on her maiden voyage and also to visit IMM's main office in New York to discuss details of his forthcoming retirement.

I was wondering if he was really going to retire after the voyage, do you think he would have wanted to jepardize his retirement by doing something to disgrace the company like not going down with the ship?[/quote:b8d8b38259]
I have read the same thing before; that Ismay was soon planning on retiring. I would think that he didn't think about his plans for after the voyage while the ship was sinking though. I see your point though and it's a good argument in his defense. :D

I don't think he was really thinking a that point about anything but here's a boat, it's going down, oh look there's a seat I might as well get in. You don't think about an awful lot more at times like that.

I agree with you TTF

I agree too. I think when you are in a situation like that your primal instinct for self preservation takes over. Well for most people anyway.